XYZ_Study_HC315 Sample Transcript.docx

Interviewee: XYZ_Study_HC315 Date\Time of Interview: January 1, 2021; 2:00pm Location of Interview: Not stated.

Transcriptionist: CAC

INTERVIEWER: [00:00:00.27] Today's date is January 1st, 2021. We are doing an interview with participate HC315. So, just to get started, can you tell me what your overall rating of the XYZ program was? Would you say that you were very satisfied, satisfied, neither satisfied nor dissatisfied, dissatisfied, or very dissatisfied?

PARTICIPANT: [00:00:22.07] Satisfied.

INTERVIEWER: [00:00:24.03] Ok. And why would you say you were satisfied?

PARTICIPANT: [00:00:28.29 inaudible] Satisfied, I mean, I mean, if they [00:00:34.20 inaudible] getting into the [00:00:39.13 inaudible] the service provided. You know, there's always room for improvement, so, it's, it was, I mean at least something, you know, is being done to try to address some of the issues.

INTERVIEWER: [00:00:53.29] Mm-kay. And what kinds of things could we have done, or could the program have done to make you feel very satisfied? Can you think of any of those things offhand?

PARTICIPANT: [00:01:05.06] I don't know. That's kind of a complicated question. I don't know. We, I don't know, maybe just, just take, you know, just showing the results of some of the research and, you know, some of the actions that would be taken. I guess [00:01:30.03 inaudible] what actions would be, would be taken to try to improve [00:01:34.18 inaudible].

INTERVIEWER: [00:01:35.05] Ok. So, it sounds like maybe some follow-up about.

PARTICIPANT: [00:01:40.06] [Coughs] Mm hmm.

INTERVIEWER: [00:01:40.05] What we can do maybe working with providers that would help kind of cement the way that Veterans are saying that they feel about the program. Does that sound right?

PARTICIPANT: [00:01:50.08 inaudible] That's, that's, that's, the bottom line. Yes.

INTERVIEWER: [00:01:53.13] Ok. And how easy was it for you to participate in these phone calls with your coach?

PARTICIPANT: [00:02:02.17] It was, it was, it was easy, and it was ok. I mean, with being able to, you know, set up the appointment ahead of time and, you know, and I would just try to make sure I had the space cleared and, and, you know, open time for the interviews.

INTERVIEWER: [00:02:19.01] Ok.

PARTICIPANT: [00:02:19.26] A couple questions.

INTERVIEWER: [00:02:21.18] Ok. Was there anything that you would change about the calls?

PARTICIPANT: [00:02:29.14; long pause] No.

INTERVIEWER: [00:02:31.00] Ok. The, the number of calls you received was good. The length of calls. All that was ok?

PARTICIPANT: [00:02:38.13 inaudible] That was ok. Yes.

INTERVIEWER: [00:02:40.25] Ok. What did you like most about the XYZ program?

PARTICIPANT: [00:02:47.19] I don't know. I guess, maybe just being able to express your, your, your view of how your opinion of, of your experiences there with your doctor's visits.

INTERVIEWER: [00:03:01.21] Mm-kay.

PARTICIPANT: [00:03:03.15] And to, you know, to be speaking with someone who could possibly make a difference.

INTERVIEWER: [00:03:10.11] Ok. And I know I alluded to this a little bit earlier but is there anything that you would change or add to the program to make it better for other Veterans?

PARTICIPANT: [00:03:22.00] Maybe like, maybe year or so check-ins with, with Veterans just to see if anything is, I mean, and just give them a report on progress made or not made, maybe.

INTERVIEWER: [00:03:45.18] Ok. Thank you. What helped you stay engaged in the XYZ study?

PARTICIPANT: [00:03:54.19] I would just say for me personally I just, just the fact that I had agreed to let you know to, I mean just, you know, my, my word of participation just then that is what it was.

INTERVIEWER: [00:04:19.20] Ok. Did anything make staying involved or engaged in the program difficult?

PARTICIPANT: [00:04:27.11] No.

INTERVIEWER: [00:04:27.12] No? Ok. We're going to switch gears a little bit and talk more about your coach.

PARTICIPANT: [00:04:33.10] Ok.

INTERVIEWER: [00:04:33.26] So, how satisfied were you with working with Coach1? Would you say that you were very satisfied, satisfied, neither satisfied nor dissatisfied.

PARTICIPANT: [00:04:43.11 inaudible]

INTERVIEWER: [00:04:43.25] Dissatsif-.

PARTICIPANT: [00:04:44.27 inaudible]

INTERVIEWER: [00:04:45.20] Oh, I'm sorry.

PARTICIPANT: [00:04:47.24] Very satisfied.

INTERVIEWER: [00:04:49.24] Ok. And why do you say that?

PARTICIPANT: [00:04:51.06] I mean, they was, they, I mean, they were a listener and, and being, you know concerned, wanted to try to help the Veteran understand, you know, to the best of their ability.

INTERVIEWER: [00:05:09.29] Ok.

PARTICIPANT: [00:05:10.05] And, and just, you know, and, you know, being a listener and just taking the experiences from the Veterans.

INTERVIEWER: [00:05:23.12] What kinds of things would Coach1 do to make you know that they were listening.

PARTICIPANT: [00:05:34.08] Not cutting. Not cutting the Veteran off or just by, by, by allowing the Veteran to speak without cutting him off or trying to manipulate the direction of, of the responses, I guess.

INTERVIEWER: [00:05:52.11] Ok. And what did you like most about talking with Coach1?

PARTICIPANT: [00:06:01.01] As I said, you know, improving of the experiences at the, at the VA hospital worked, and I feel that the experiences are different depending on your race or whatever the case and I just, I felt that the opportunity to just, you know, share things and other experience was a positive, I guess.

INTERVIEWER: [00:06:34.23] Ok. And you said that your experiences are a little bit different depending on your race. Can you tell me more about that?

PARTICIPANT: [00:06:44.12] Well, I feel that sometimes that the, you know, as far as being a quote/unquote Minority is sometimes they're not taken seriously. If they spoke on things in one way or another, go and retrieve notes from the visits, and the notes might express some different conversations you've had with the doctors, you know, to in a sense be more supportive in a sense too.

INTERVIEWER: [00:07:30.24] Ok. Can you think of any examples where this has happened to you?

PARTICIPANT: [00:07:42.04] Well, yes, I mean, I've had visits to where, I mean, I just, I don't feel that I was being taken serious so you know the conversation or, or, you know, it might be a doctor and then maybe a couple of trainees or students with them. You know some questions or things like that again and you would catch a, what's the name, what's the word for it. You can catch like a, a smile or I got you type of look from the young doctors and the students that, you know, I don't think it was intended for the Veteran or for me to see.

INTERVIEWER: [00:08:51.04] Mm-hmm.

PARTICIPANT: [00:08:52.00] You know, it's almost like a game being played.

INTERVIEWER: [00:08:54.22] Ok. And then, does, do you find that this happens in any aspect of your care more than others like maybe more in primary care than in specialty care or something like that?

PARTICIPANT: [00:09:10.26] So much across the board.

INTERVIEWER: [00:09:14.06] Ok.

PARTICIPANT: [00:09:15.08] I guess, I don't know. It's, it's, it's, it's, I think there's some practice that they can, you know, they know they can get away with and in a sense, I mean, you know, you're, don’ t know the word for it. You know if it's going to be, if you're going to be looked at, you know, you're going to, you're going to clean the space before you look at it. Before the person that's coming in to maybe take at a look at things or how you're performing or doing the things yeah, you're clean the space of messiness.

INTERVIEWER: [00:09:57.08] Ok. And have you ever been able to take any actions to combat the way that you feel?

PARTICIPANT: [00:10:07.28] Well, I've been to the patient advocate a couple times, I think, with, with, with some of the things that I've taken issue with.

INTERVIEWER: [00:10:19.02] Ok. And has that been helpful for you?

PARTICIPANT: [00:10:22.28] I think it, it, it gave results. I mean, it gave results.

INTERVIEWER: [00:10:29.13] Ok. I'm not sure if you know this but XYZ is focused specifically on the care that X Race/Ethnicity Veterans receive in regards to their health care. Do you have any thoughts?

PARTICIPANT: [00:10:42.25 inaudible]

INTERVIEWER: [00:10:42.28] About a study that's focused specifically on this group of people?

PARTICIPANT: [00:10:48.21] Well, I have, I mean, like I say, I mean, you know, you're exam might be, ok, you could say that your arm or your back would or something would have injury from. They might do, do something to try to rule out your heart from being part of the problem but then, ok, the heart checks out but then everything is ok. They send you on your way but you're still living with whatever, the, the issue of the issue is. They're not going to do anything to try to diagnose the thing. I mean, and physical therapy is not just the answer to it all. I mean, we got to find out what to do for sure, to be able to, you know, address it with physical therapy or whatever.

INTERVIEWER: [00:11:51.19] Ok.

PARTICIPANT: [00:11:53.10] And for, you know, just having, you know, we got to get to a solid diagnosis of what it is.

INTERVIEWER: [00:11:59.19] Mm-hmm.

PARTICIPANT: [00:12:00.21] I mean, I mean, they, yeah, we checked out the heart, the heart was ok but we still, I mean, but still don’t know what problem is. We don't, we don't, we don't search for, for the cause, the root cause of it, you know, it's just go to therapy.

INTERVIEWER: [00:12:19.26] Mm-hmm. Sounds like maybe what you're saying is that it's maybe a good idea that we're focusing specifically on this group of people because maybe providers don't kind of dig deep enough to find out what's wrong?

PARTICIPANT: [00:12:42.10] Yes, not one person with one size fits all type of approach, I guess.

INTERVIEWER: [00:12:54.15] Ok.

PARTICIPANT: [00:12:54.16] Something along those lines.

INTERVIEWER: [00:12:55.28] Ok. The fact that the study was focused specifically on X Race/Ethnicity Veterans, did that play a role in your decision to participate?

PARTICIPANT: [00:13:08.26] Just be, you know, to just have to I guess have that conversation.

INTERVIEWER: [00:13:17.16] Ok. And so, we're, we're interested in the way that Veterans perceived the role that race/ethnicity plays in their health care. Do you think that this, that other Veterans who are also X race/ethnicity may be experiencing a similar type of experience or do you think that maybe this is an isolated case?

PARTICIPANT: [00:13:45.04] You know, to various visits just X race/ethnicity Veterans, you know, speaking of that you can relate to it and, you know, just the, the few that I do know people you know, I can relate and understand their grievances with their visits.

INTERVIEWER: [00:14:21.12] Ok. Alright. Thank you for sharing.

PARTICIPANT: [00:14:26.21 inaudible]

INTERVIEWER: [00:14:26.26] I'm sorry?

PARTICIPANT: [00:14:28.02] I was just saying so it's not an isolated issue.

INTERVIEWER: [00:14:32.04] Ok.

PARTICIPANT: [00:14:33.02] I don't feel.

INTERVIEWER: [00:14:33.23] Ok. Thank you very much for sharing your experiences. I know that can sometimes be difficult.

PARTICIPANT: [00:14:41.12] Yeah.

INTERVIEWER: [00:14:43.06] Can you give me an example of something that you talked about with your coach was, that you found to be especially helpful?

PARTICIPANT: [00:14:55.17 inaudible] I mean, that I spoke with that would be helpful. I don't know. I guess, maybe just approach each Veteran, I guess, as an individual, you don't know, you don't approach today's, or, or, or this Veteran with that visit or whatever the case, I mean, you know, just listen to the Veteran.

INTERVIEWER: [00:15:46.02] Ok.

PARTICIPANT: [00:15:48.28] And, and try to get a, you know, a diagnosis to what’s ailing you since that gives to the Veteran of whether, you know, a thorough understanding of what is causing the health issue.

INTERVIEWER: [00:16:10.16] Is there anything that you talked about with Coach1 that you were able to then implement into your own care? Like maybe you had a discussion with a provider based on something you worked with Coach1 about or anything like that.

PARTICIPANT: [00:16:25.29] Well, just trying to be assertive in a sense to the provider regarding your health care or your issue and you know, and, and they're like, hey, expect a, a, a direction of a particular diagnosis that, ok, I'm giving you this medicine for or I'm sending you to therapy for. Ok, but, you know, like at least the Veteran is ok or something like that, I wouldn't, you know, I wouldn't know, ok but maybe from the doctor's opinion. Ok, and we can, you know, and it helps the Veteran to be able to assist in his recovery. Ok, or whatever the case, you know just to say like if the, the leg is hurting but you're going to say it's in the back of your neck where the issue is coming from, ok, well explain that. How, how does that affect, you know, my, my lower extremities, you know, or I'm doing things that you suggest maybe have a benefit to the issue but, you know, it, it, it doesn't, I mean, and doctor knows the period of time, it doesn't seem like it's addressing the lower extremity issues, so, and that's not happening, I mean, you know, we should maybe take another look at things, you know, we might have missed something or overlooked it from a, from a medical perspective.

INTERVIEWER: [00:18:35.25] Ok. Thank you. Is there anything that you talked about with Coach1 that maybe you did not find to be very helpful?

PARTICIPANT: [00:18:51.09] No, I can't say that I did. I mean, like I say, everything sounds good, you know on paper but is it not done with the same energy. Is a real issue, you know, we can make it sound good or look good on paper but you know, in a way that is going to be beneficial to the Veteran and his, his or her acceptance of what they hear from their provider.

INTERVIEWER: [00:19:34.00] Is there any and you talked about maybe implementing something with the same energy, is there something that maybe you did try to implement that just didn't work very well that you and Coach1 had discussed?

PARTICIPANT: [00:19:48.18] Discuss. No, you're saying with Coach1. Discuss with Coach1 like not so much with the doctors. I, I feel good with Coach1, I pretty much value my experiences with my visits at the VA.

INTERVIEWER: [00:20:05.28] Mm-hmm.

PARTICIPANT: [00:20:06.28] Express you know, to a satisfactory point of myself.

INTERVIEWER: [00:20:13.02] I'm sorry. Maybe I didn't ask the question correctly. Is there anything that maybe you talked about with Coach1 that you did try to do with your doctor that maybe didn't work quite the way that Coach1 had suggested or that you expected it would?

PARTICIPANT: [00:20:31.03] Well, just the delivery of your complaint of, of the issues of that day of your visit. So, there is, you are satisfied with the approach.

INTERVIEWER: [00:20:49.08] Mm-hmm.

PARTICIPANT: [00:20:50.07] The care giver, I mean, yeah, some that's a long you know, with the assertiveness in a sense.

INTERVIEWER: [00:20:59.00] Mm-hmm.

PARTICIPANT: [00:20:59.23] You know, I can, you know, and they were trying to help me to understand how to deliver, you know, the issues to the doctors on their visits or whatever and, and, and the satisfaction you walk away with, I mean, I think you know the visits or my, you know, whether it was phone visits or in-person visits and I don't know, I mean, you know, some visits you might get a, a little bit more satisfactory response or action but then you would have a time to where you walk away, get more confused than you did before you went in for the visit or spoke on the issue whether it was in person or the phone.

INTERVIEWER: [00:22:03.19] Ok.

PARTICIPANT: [00:22:05.09 inaudible] Key point.

INTERVIEWER: [00:22:12.11] Is there anything that Coach1.

PARTICIPANT: [00:22:14.19 inaudible]

INTERVIEWER: [00:22:14.24] I'm sorry.

PARTICIPANT: [00:22:16.00] No, I was just going to say, I mean, there's only so far to go to say to try to express that issue that I mean take a serious to try to assist you or point you know or point of relief. I know I was, you know, I was just backed off and mentally withdraw from it myself too far or the doctor too far from mental breakdown, I guess I can communicate things with the doctor.

INTERVIEWER: [00:23:09.23] Ok.

PARTICIPANT: [00:23:11.07] Yes.

INTERVIEWER: [00:23:13.15] Is there anything that you would change about the work that you did with your coach?

PARTICIPANT: [00:23:19.07] No.

INTERVIEWER: [00:23:21.25] No. Ok. Alright. And switch gears a little bit just some more general questions. How did you hear about the XYZ study?

PARTICIPANT: [00:23:35.22] Mm. I'm, I'm not really sure. I can't even remember how I got that thing. I don't know. I don't, truly remember but I think I just got invited in a letter or the invitation to participate.

INTERVIEWER: [00:23:51.11] Ok. Yeah. Sometimes we...

PARTICIPANT: [00:23:54.01 inaudible]

INTERVIEWER: [00:23:54.14] …do, we do send letters in the mail. Mm-hmm.

PARTICIPANT: [00:23:58.05] Yeah.

INTERVIEWER: [00:23:58.20] Ok. And what made you want to, what made you want to participate in the program?

PARTICIPANT: [00:24:05.19] Like, I just looking at my own experiences. The way I felt about some of them. And just kind of in the way of, just being supportive to the program, trying to get insight of, I mean, you know, your department of trying assist the, you know, the racial/ethnic Veterans or the X Veterans in a sense. Yeah, just wanting, I, I don't just really have too much of a problem with the truth, I guess I might not match what the, what the doctors might say or whatever but you know what I mean, but the reality is the reality.

INTERVIEWER: [00:25:01.22] Ok. And did you hope to get out of the XYZ study?

PARTICIPANT: [00:25:07.11] Hopefully, a better rapport with the, with the overall Veteran experience at the VA.

INTERVIEWER: [00:25:19.11] And, and did you, and did you get that? Did you gain a better experience in any way?

PARTICIPANT: [00:25:28.28; long pause] Well, I don't know if I'm so much, I mean, because you know that, that, that would be a continuing experience involving to where you know, maybe just look at it like maybe a year on or something and just look at overall how, what the Veterans [laughs] ok, with the being more assertive and explaining to their doctor, well, I want to have this question answered, all the questions answered, and if you are offered a better response from the caretakers, I mean, and they help, I mean, I guess it would take a little while to just benefit from it.

INTERVIEWER: [00:26:25.01] I guess that goes back a little bit to your suggestion of kind of a year follow up call.

PARTICIPANT: [00:26:31.21] Something like that. I mean, you know, just because we talk about it, it's not going to all be solved completely you know within a month or so. I could tell a lot of the point is overall.

INTERVIEWER: [00:27:06.04] Ok. Did XY-

PARTICIPANT: [00:27:09.02 inaudible]

INTERVIEWER: [00:27:09.23] I'm sorry.

PARTICIPANT: [00:27:10.13] I was just going to say the doctor is not the same as the doctor the other times not going, you know, go to a specialty clinic at other times, they didn't even have to have the same doctor every time you know.

INTERVIEWER: [00:27:30.01] Mm-hmm. That makes sense.

PARTICIPANT: [00:27:33.27] Yeah.

INTERVIEWER: [00:27:36.05] Did the XYZ program meet your expectations?

PARTICIPANT: [00:27:44.00] Well maybe, but really kind of hard to say. I mean XYZ assisted them in the change in support to the X race/ethnicity Veterans or the quote/unquote X Veterans. And look at a point down the road. I mean, you know, that's kind of the way that I look at it. I mean, it would be hard for me to say without seeing some changes made that came from the cooperation with the coach.

INTERVIEWER: [00:28:46.07] Ok. Ok. Do you think about, do you think any differently about treating your goals, your goals for I'm sorry, do you think any differently about goals for treating your issue after participating in the program?

PARTICIPANT: [00:29:04.20] Well, I think pretty much for myself, just personally, I was enjoying a lot of the things that the other people spoke of already, I think I was considering things already done at htat time just as I express my information. And as, you know, you all as a team that's doing the survey would look at things and, you know, you know, allow items for other Veterans, you know, just share insight to, you know, that maybe another Veteran would benefit from, from my, you know, participation in the survey as well. That's what I mean, you know, I, yes, I mean, I, I know it's just [00:30:06.11 inaudible] individual that is a Veteran but, I mean, I think, you know, they're all basic or, you know, just for to be taken seriously for health care I mean.

INTERVIEWER: [00:30:25.27] Ok. Did XYZ help you think about other ways to treat your issue?

PARTICIPANT: [00:30:38.15] I don't, I don't really just think so really so much. I, I have like I said a lot of the things [00:30:45.27 inaudible]. As we looked at it, I] was kind of nonplussed, I mean, you know, I, I had a, we had been practicing those type of approaches and has given those, been given those approaches so, you know, a chance to work. A lot of the, you know, the exercises in the toolbox physical therapy, stretching, you know, just taking your meds and things like that and stuff. I think, me personally, I feel that I do the best I can with what I can do with the limitations of whatever those issues might be that, you know, but I help myself without, you know, truly knowing exactly what it is or why it is that the issue is there but as far as all of the things in the toolbox and, you know, exercise and things like that, I, I feel that I, I do the best I can.

INTERVIEWER: [00:32:17.02] Ok. And you mentioned.

PARTICIPANT: [00:32:19.11 inaudible]

INTERVIEWER: [00:32:20.02] I'm sorry.

PARTICIPANT: [00:32:20.19] Go ahead. You go ahead.

INTERVIEWER: [00:32:22.29] You, you mentioned that you kind of already had some of these tools in your toolbox and you already knew some of the things you talked about with Coach1. Did you learn anything new from the XYZ program?

PARTICIPANT: [00:32:36.13] Not so much. I mean enough to be, you know get to the, to the cause I mean, but a lot of the things, I'd, I'd already heard. I already, I was already aware of those things and, you know, I mean that it would be right to say, ok, we're going to go physical therapy, I mean, we go to physical therapy and you're asked to perform this exercise, this exercise, stretch this, stretch that, I mean, like if something so brand new.

INTERVIEWER: [00:33:14.17] Mm-hmm.

PARTICIPANT: [00:33:15.23] But like, I, you know, I'm like hey I do this already or I could do this. I mean, you know, there was a, yeah, you know, I mean, we can't serve in the military without this. You know, conditioning the body and stretching the body to try to deal with the different things or things that you could get into. We, we, we do that stuff, all Veterans are doing. I don't understand, I don't see how you could have trouble on that. Just if it was there to not be knowing how to physically stretch the body to ease the issue so that you feel and, you know, so everything is in you know [00:34:19.28 inaudible] this, this is not, a lot of is just not brand new. You know? Anybody that's ever played any sports, you know [00:34:30.23 inaudible] younger Veterans coming from high school, you know, or track or basketball or anything, I mean, we, we don't do stuff that physical as that, that is primarily the same thing they're hearing up in therapy sessions that, ok, I mean, I, I been doing this, you know and I, I'm still here you know, I’m still here.

INTERVIEWER: [00:35:04.13] Mm-hmm.

PARTICIPANT: [00:35:04.25 inaudible] Just maybe just try to pinpoint where the issue [00:35:12.13 inaudible] that, that's the hard part I feel when it comes to dealing with the doctors, I mean, and that's part of the [00:35:24.00 inaudible] me or for most Veterans of Color or whoever.

INTERVIEWER: [00:35:31.11] Ok. Ok. Thank you for that feedback. And then did being in the program change the way that you talk to your doctor about your issue care at all?

PARTICIPANT: [00:35:46.15] As I said, not much because a lot of the, the, the things and suggestions and things like that, I was already trying to apply those approaches to my visits. And as I expected, there's kind of a difference, you know, because they're just a VA hospital compared to elsewhere you know, is just positions and things like, I mean, you know, it's like your, your approach is just to direct the doctors to the issues that you feel maybe is central to the body or where the issue is in the body as opposed to at the VA, you know, you could say that it's your arm but they want it to be your leg. They going to make it your leg.

INTERVIEWER: [00:37:01.29] Mm-hmm.

PARTICIPANT: [00:37:04.10] And by the time you walk of the visit at the VA, the issue is here in the arm, you know, it's not your arm it's your leg.

INTERVIEWER: [00:37:16.24] Sounds like you mentioned kind of being assertive and it sounds like you've tried that and maybe that's still, that just isn't working out. They're just not listening to you.

PARTICIPANT: [00:37:28.27] I mean, in a sense, yeah, I mean, you know, the stiff is going to be wrong. It's going to be incorrect, the problem, or something like that, I mean, you know, they're going to, you know, it's just that the Veteran is, is, you know, just not central, you know.

INTERVIEWER: [00:37:56.10] Do.

PARTICIPANT: [00:37:56.27] But that's, that's, that's kind of the way that I interpret it, you know, at the visits and things.

INTERVIEWER: [00:38:04.16] Do you think that anything could be done to improve, to improve on that and the way that, that you've been treated and maybe getting providers to take a moment and listen?

PARTICIPANT: [00:38:20.29] I don’t know, not sure I really expect it to get better or not better, I mean, as I say, the next month approaches, you know. They're obviously there and I don't need them but I do. The question that you're asking, that's the, that's putting a lot of trust and faith in the system.

INTERVIEWER: [00:38:57.01] Mm-hmm.

PARTICIPANT: [00:38:57.19] That it, it's just natural he can't, he can't come to that, that level of acceptance to just be well, I mean, you know, one might talk it up or, or try to talk it up a level or two but then it's above him going to just take it back down, you know, a level, you know, maybe. But you know [00:39:33.10 inaudible] to take it back, take you back down notches that, you know the level of acceptance of things and that’s what I would say after, you know, you just come to a point of acceptance and realization that it is what it is. Sometimes, it comes, you know, it's just not meant to be I don't think> I mean, you know, man, in a sense, you know, I mean, man, I knew what it was, I got it. I just don't feel that it can be achieved with humanity in a sense to just be fair or just open to anybody other than one's self and everything is all about advantage like a game of tennis in a sense, you know the advantage point wins.

INTERVIEWER: [00:40:40.19] Mm-hmm.

PARTICIPANT: [00:40:43.20] You know, it's about to have, and, and with that type of approach a people it's not, I won't, I won't say the, I mean, that's just, I mean, I don't know and after eight years of just trying to, you know, to just settle down or don't want it to be that way or that. After a while, you know, we just have to accept that we are what we are. I mean, I'm sorry that's just the way I am.

INTERVIEWER: [00:41:24.17] Ok. Is there anything else.

PARTICIPANT: [00:41:30.09 inaudible]

INTERVIEWER: [00:41:31.00] Oh, I'm sorry.

PARTICIPANT: [00:41:32.19] No, you go ahead.

INTERVIEWER: [00:41:34.00] Is there anything else that you would like to share about your health care or your health that we haven't talked about since participating in?

PARTICIPANT: [00:41:48.13] No, I don't think so. I think we covered everything. I mean, like I say, it's, if, if there was anything I would look for out of it is, you know, that as we have our visits give a diagnosis, you know, just don't take this go ahead, ok, for what? What's causing the problem?

INTERVIEWER: [00:42:14.21] Mm-hmm.

PARTICIPANT: [00:42:15.22] Can we, I mean, where on the paper does it say that it's an issue or, or just say a problem or something as examples but you don't get that at the VA. I mean, I mean, you know, maybe you're not going to change it by not saying it. And we're not going to change by avoiding of the, of the Veterans involved in an issue if we don't go directly too.

INTERVIEWER: [00:42:49.07 inaudible]

PARTICIPANT: [00:42:50.05 inaudible] That's the only thing that I would say, you know, I mean, you know, as I say, you know, but, but I, you know, like I say I feel that a lot of [00:43:02.05 inaudible] but I feel the majority or many of the X Veterans or quote/unquote X race/ethnicity Veterans that their, their experiences whether they was helped because of at, at, at a point you just give in, you know, it's, it's, you know.

INTERVIEWER: [00:43:32.27] Mm-hmm.

PARTICIPANT: [00:43:32.29] Just write yourself off, I guess. And just let it be because it's, it's, you know, it's going to affect you in other ways, you know, that they're from the mental perspective, so, you have to do what's available sometime just for yourself as the individual because that challenge that is there for you right there is huge. It's not even, you know small, but could cause more damage than it could recovery.

INTERVIEWER: [00:44:11.02] Ok. Well, thank you very much for your feedback. So, I'm going to go ahead the recorder.

END OF AUDIO